Abbey Road Orchestra - Violins 1 announced

[Muziksculp]

Hi @Karma ,

It's nice to see you on this forum, at least they don't delete my posts here like they do at VI-C.

I went forward with Pre-Ordering AR1-Vlns 1 Pro ver. and from what I heard so far, they sound awesome ! Thanks for all the effort to develop it.

So, next is Celli. and that's an instant buy for me as well.

I have two questions for you.

Q1. Will there be Sordino Strings modules in the future ? If you can't answer this question, it's OK.

Q2. Not directly related to AR1-Vlns 1 , but rather to AR2 Iconic Strings Library, can we expect some improvements to that library, especially load times, and other reported issues ? ( I think I'm not the only one who hopes this will happen).

Thanks,
Muziksculp

[Karma]

Q1. Will there be Sordino Strings modules in the future ? If you can't answer this question, it's OK.

Q2. Not directly related to AR1-Vlns 1 , but rather to AR2 Iconic Strings Library, can we expect some improvements to that library, especially load times, and other reported issues ? ( I think I'm not the only one who hopes this will happen).

Hello! I can answer from what I know... which is not much I'm afraid!

1. I think in taking an educated guess this content would certainly come down the line. Right now our focus is very much on getting the core fundamentals done, and done right in this great space. The extras, whilst desirable, are indeed extras!

2. A plugin update will certainly roll out for this (similar improvements made to the ARO plugin), but I am afraid I do not know when. I do believe there are a few things in AR2 that the team are aware of, but as for timeframes I'm sorry to say I don't know more. I can only really comment on the things I am responsible for (and even then, of course I cannot say everything).

[Muziksculp]

Q1. Will there be Sordino Strings modules in the future ? If you can't answer this question, it's OK.

Q2. Not directly related to AR1-Vlns 1 , but rather to AR2 Iconic Strings Library, can we expect some improvements to that library, especially load times, and other reported issues ? ( I think I'm not the only one who hopes this will happen).

Hello! I can answer from what I know... which is not much I'm afraid!

1. I think in taking an educated guess this content would certainly come down the line. Right now our focus is very much on getting the core fundamentals done, and done right in this great space. The extras, whilst desirable, are indeed extras!

2. A plugin update will certainly roll out for this (similar improvements made to the ARO plugin), but I am afraid I do not know when. I do believe there are a few things in AR2 that the team are aware of, but as for timeframes I'm sorry to say I don't know more. I can only really comment on the things I am responsible for (and even then, of course I cannot say everything).

Hi @Karma,

Thanks.

I appreciate your feedback. and look forward to enjoy the upcoming AR1 Modular Orch. releases as they roll out.

It's good to know that the Spitfire team will eventually improve / fix the issues with AR2 Iconic Strings Library, I guess we just have to be very patient. given it was released a while back.

I wish you, and the rest of the Spitfire Development team all the best.

Cheers,
Muziksculp

[Guy Rowland]

One more observation just to be ready for it - Spitfire have a long and rich history of making modular libraries that vanish when all the modules are finished, and it all gets wrapped in a single unified product. BML is the most obvious, but Sable was sold as something people might want to just own a part of. So I'd fully expect the modular concept here to be quietly dropped further down the road. I don't mind at all really, it doesn't make a lot of sense to own just the first violins of anything, but it just feels like insincere marketing to call it a modular library when the mundane reality is just "sorry, we just have to release it in stages".

[GR Baumann]

The crux!

insincere marketing

Yes!

[doctoremmet]

To stick to just facts: modular libraries that were sold as such in the past, that were eventually wrapped into a bundle: yes - insincere marketing.

Their current modular range: let’s wait and see what will happen and call it insincere if and when there’s an actual reason to.

[Yasin Yavuz]

One more observation just to be ready for it - Spitfire have a long and rich history of making modular libraries that vanish when all the modules are finished, and it all gets wrapped in a single unified product. BML is the most obvious, but Sable was sold as something people might want to just own a part of. So I'd fully expect the modular concept here to be quietly dropped further down the road. I don't mind at all really, it doesn't make a lot of sense to own just the first violins of anything, but it just feels like insincere marketing to call it a modular library when the mundane reality is just "sorry, we just have to release it in stages".

Well, we've been following sample library market for more two decades, most of us know the tricks devs use for producing and marketing by now.
In Spitfire's case I'm actually curious about their future. Eventually they will finish Abbey Road Orchestra which they claim this is their best. And then what? Go to another studio to do same exact old thing? They had done that like a dozen times. Some other devs try to build a catalog and keep selling (sometimes updating/expanding) those 20 year old libraries. Like we didn't have drums now we have, we will make guitars next etc. You get my point.
Spitfire have done some niche/experimental stuff but they mainly focus on traditional orchestra. I mean what else will they do, use 40 mic positions? Where can you go from world's most famous studio? Some small developers experiment to improve realism and playability. But this Abbey Road Orchestra looks like pretty much same thing that we've seen countless times. Honestly I can't believe they can afford it while competing themselves (selling their older libraries) and dozens of other developers.

[Linos]

Yes, that's the question Yasin. If this is the culmination of what's possible with current sampling technology, where to go for Spitfire Audio after the Abbey Road Orchestra has been completed? Continuing in the same way will not be possible. They will be forced to innovate one way or another, or find other ways of creating revenue. VSL was at that point of the completion of their VI series. And they will be again after the Synchron Series is complete. At least they have the Synchron Stage recording service for additional revenue. But their sampling department will have to find new ways of creating products that consumers need, or at least want. In a way Eastwest has reached that point years ago with the completion of the Hollywood Orchestra. That was also the best sampled orchestra they could create, with no corners cut. Since then, they have released quite a few sample libraries, none of them with a purely orchestral focus. Maybe Spitfire Audio will do something similar. Time will tell.

[Guy Rowland]

I actually like what East West did. Rather than start all over again with a load of HOOPLA, they went HOOPUS. 95% same good samples, 5% shiny and new samples all in a better player and simplified instrument structures. They could have still done more with scripting and unified patches - maybe there's another version to come.

Also LASS 3 was a good step forward. A few odd design choices, but overall much much easier to use and the samples still sound great.

Spitfire on the other hand don't really go in for making what they have better, their business model is to entice lust of the new, and forget about all that old crap. I mean, they have reversioned, but SCS has all the same problems Sable had, all the clunks, bangs and nasty sample starts in place. I demonstrated how it only takes a literal minute to clean it up a dodgy WAV in RX to be massively better. That's a lot of work for a whole library, but about 0.1% of the budget of new recordings. And Sable/SCS always did sound absolutely stellar.

I don't know where they do go from here either. Once you've done two Air studios, Maida Vale and Abbey Road... I mean, the Cistine Chapel? They've gone for a lot of sound design and orch effects, but no so much for world instruments, maybe that's a future path.

[Yasin Yavuz]

I actually like what East West did. Rather than start all over again with a load of HOOPLA, they went HOOPUS. 95% same good samples, 5% shiny and new samples all in a better player and simplified instrument structures. They could have still done more with scripting and unified patches - maybe there's another version to come.

Also LASS 3 was a good step forward. A few odd design choices, but overall much much easier to use and the samples still sound great.

Spitfire on the other hand don't really go in for making what they have better, their business model is to entice lust of the new, and forget about all that old crap. I mean, they have reversioned, but SCS has all the same problems Sable had, all the clunks, bangs and nasty sample starts in place. I demonstrated how it only takes a literal minute to clean it up a dodgy WAV in RX to be massively better. That's a lot of work for a whole library, but about 0.1% of the budget of new recordings. And Sable/SCS always did sound absolutely stellar.

I don't know where they do go from here either. Once you've done two Air studios, Maida Vale and Abbey Road... I mean, the Cistine Chapel? They've gone for a lot of sound design and orch effects, but no so much for world instruments, maybe that's a future path.

I have HOOPUS and I agree. It's still pretty good and new 18 Violins patch is my favourite of Hollywood Strings.
What I'm saying is every business model has pros and cons. For example Projectsam libraries are old but they try to keep them alive with updates, expansions, price drops, freebies etc.
Spitfire don't do them much. Their model makes people want new and shiny products but meanwhile they lose people's interests into older products. Because they always say new ones are bigger and better. Though in reality there isn't a revolutionary difference between them. I thinks this is the reason they released SCS Essentials and brought back old Albions years later. Probably they will have to do similar things with other libraries.

[playz123]

A year or two ago I purchased a library from Spitfire called Abbey Road One, which I assumed would provide me with the full orchestra recorded at Abbey Road…similar to the BBC Symphony Orchestra library. After that, I was then encouraged to enhance ARO by adding Grand Brass, Sparking Woodwinds, Legendary Low Strings and Thematic Horn libraries, which I did. The total is nearly 100 GB of samples. But now I am receiving emails extolling the virtues of supposedly even higher end versions of the strings alone…with more instruments to follow. Sorry, but for this person, enough is enough. I’m simply not buying into this new release and I’ll stick with what I have and what I thought I had. I can only imagine the total cost of this new modular library as/if new sections are added, so that is another deciding factor for me. So, I for one, will just say that I’ll ‘pass’ on this, but I do hope purchasers will find the new library of value. And, as an aside, it’s obvious that Spitfire just isn’t the same company anymore, since the days of “Christian and Paul”, and it offended me how Christian was treated. So for now at least I am avoiding further purchases from Spitfire…not so much out of spite, but out of buyer fatigue. Just my ‘2 pennies worth’.

[Linos]

The library has been released. Spitfire Audio provided an NFR copy for me, as I am writing a review. I am downloading now.

[IFM]

I've downloaded, but won't have a chance to explore it till tomorrow morning. Looking forward to giving it a test at 48k and 96k to see how the M1 Ultra handles it!

[woodrose]

And, as an aside, it’s obvious that Spitfire just isn’t the same company anymore, since the days of “Christian and Paul”, and it offended me how Christian was treated. So for now at least I am avoiding further purchases from Spitfire…not so much out of spite, but out of buyer fatigue. Just my ‘2 pennies worth’.

This tedious notion of Christian Henson as the noble martyr that has been done dirty really needs to be laid to rest.
Henson publicly supported trans-exclusionary radical feminists on Twitter, the company he co-founded (Spitfire Audio) had the backbone to distance themselves from awful bigotry of that nature, then Henson quietly retreated from the public eye.
Not once during all of the time that has passed since has Christian shown that he maybe had a bad take on things and has since grown as a person.
The silence has been deafening.

Good on Spitfire Audio for denouncing TERFs.
(Though I believe Henson is still involved with the company,
but not publicly.)

[Guy Rowland]

It's probably wishful thinking that we keep the Christian Henson saga from this thread. It's been discussed here in the BWW thread The Witch Trials of JK Rowling, but that is a very long thread with a huge range of subject matter. IMO it is one of the best threads we've ever had at TSB because despite some difficulties everyone has remained civil and is prepared to go into the nuances and complexities that this very thorny subject deserves, and there's no space for any of that in this sample library thread imo.

With that said, looking forward to everyone's first experiences of the library.

[Kohima]

And, as an aside, it’s obvious that Spitfire just isn’t the same company anymore, since the days of “Christian and Paul”, and it offended me how Christian was treated. So for now at least I am avoiding further purchases from Spitfire…not so much out of spite, but out of buyer fatigue. Just my ‘2 pennies worth’.

Since that I don't buy anything from them either.

[wst3]

It would be nice to have a variety of libraries for any given instrument, but it is not a must have for me, and even so I've racked up a small collection too.

I like the sound of Abbey Road, not surprising, it is a room we've all heard more than once. (familiarity and all that?)

The legato seems useful, under the right fingers.

But it just doesn't strike me as a must-have. If I were going to buy yet another string library it would probably be LASS. I've heard very few demos that did not impress. The price is a barrier, at least until I attract a wealthier clientele - or more to the point, clients who want that sound.

I am curious to see what the entire AR orchestra looks/sounds like. For now I am quite happy with Alex Wallbank's Cinematic Studio Orchestra, even without the percussion. And when that doesn't fit I have strings from Spitfire, Cinesamples, Orchestral Tools, and ProjectSam, still my favorite "sound".

[IFM]

Did a quick run though this morning. Sounds very nice especially if you back off the vibrato a touch. I will agree that I can get similar results with 18 Violins from EW on some passages but what I enjoy about Spitfire, and the same goes for BBCSO, is I can play a fast line with short, long and fast turns without having to switch articulations and it sounds very convincing…at least enough so that I can represent what I’m trying to achieve and can tweak later.

I also did this test at 96k and ran two mic positions with no issues. I didn’t have time to get deeper.

[Linos]

Just finished writing a long review of the library. It should be published soon. There is no point in reproducing it here. But I would like to share the mockup I made to familiarise myself with the library. It's four instances of ARO: 1st Violins, for first and second violins, each with divisi. The low strings are Spitfire Appassionata. Winds, brass, harp and percussion are all from Spitfire Audio's BBCSO.

ARO Vl 1 Test Track.mp3

(3.88 MiB) Downloaded 373 times

[Guy Rowland]

Only listened on the laptop, but that's great Linos. Feels very natural.

[Linos]

Thank you Guy. The library is great to work with.