Can you be objective about your material?

[Lawrence]

Personally, I go in phases.

There are times during which I find my own songs and compositions quite felicitous. At other times, I wonder why I ever thought I could write a note of music, everything sounds bad to me.

The truth, of course, lies somewhere in between for most people.

My recent songwriting partner Abby and I started writing together with no preconceptions about what sort of material we would write. Our main shared interest was in sync placements. That’s evolved somewhat and we’re about to release an “album” (whatever the heck THAT means nowadays.) We were a few songs short, so I decided to look back through my catalog and I did a lot of listening. Some of my songs were substantially better than I remembered, some substantially worse but as a whole, it was an interesting experiment and a productive learning experience. I ended up finding three songs that I had never fleshed out completely, did some work on them, and Abby sang them. I’m quite pleased with the results.

I also found plenty of songs starts and full productions that were bad enough to make me shudder either lyrically or musically, and demo mixes were terrible (lots of those.)

Do y’all feel you’ve achieved the proper balance of self appreciation and self loathing, musically speaking?

[Guy Rowland]

I re-listened to that 90s lo-fi indie library album a while back. It was an interesting experience. I liked quite a lot, a few failures.

I seem to care more about lyrics than I used to. I have no appreciation of poetry at all (I am an absolute philistine), but I can tell clumsy lyric-writing and I've done my fair share. One song felt like "now I'm going to write a song about THIS issue", which is never good.

I'm so pleased when something passes muster a few years later. I quite enjoy writing in character - not so much story songs but I like writing from a different perspective to my own. Probably the writer in me.

As for the music side of things, I find I listen to and enjoy collaborations more than just me on my own.

[Daryl]

I think that I can only be objective when enough time has passed that I don't remember the composing process. After that, I think I'm fairly objective. I have learned to squash that voice that tells me I'm no good. I have learned to accept my place, and am content with that.

The other thing is to remind myself why I write what I do. If it's solely to make money, then the income is the only thing that matters. If it's a combination of doing what I want, and making money, then I bear that in mind when "judging" myself. If it's just because I wanted to write it, then part of the process is enjoying it, so even if it's no good, it doesn't matter.

[RobS]

I can't stand listening to my music, in the immediate. In that sense I'm not objective, because I despise all that I produce, even if some of it objectively must be good. If enough time has passed, and better still if I don't know it's my music I'm listening to, I become pretty objective and make better judgements... so I will be objective on what I'm writing now in a few years.

[Luke]

I think that I can only be objective when enough time has passed that I don't remember the composing process. After that, I think I'm fairly objective. I have learned to squash that voice that tells me I'm no good. I have learned to accept my place, and am content with that.

The other thing is to remind myself why I write what I do. If it's solely to make money, then the income is the only thing that matters. If it's a combination of doing what I want, and making money, then I bear that in mind when "judging" myself. If it's just because I wanted to write it, then part of the process is enjoying it, so even if it's no good, it doesn't matter.

This strikes me as a wise approach, and very balanced way of being. I vacillate very often along similar lines, with the added angle that music inherently is borne from our experiences and emotions, informing what we do subconsciously, so who am I to judge what's in there? If it moves me, there must be a reason for it, ergo, it fulfilled a purpose. Low bar that one.

[Lawrence]

I always enjoy hearing that genius composers (Daryl, Rob, just to name two in this thread) have the same struggles with self doubt as I, a worker in the trenches, experience.

I also enjoy the tales of overcoming those voices, which one has to do to carry on.

[Daryl]

I always enjoy hearing that genius composers (Daryl, Rob, just to name two in this thread) have the same struggles with self doubt as I, a worker in the trenches, experience.

I also enjoy the tales of overcoming those voices, which one has to do to carry on.

Pffft, I can't speak for Rob, but I'm no genius composer. Just an average working guy (but not Guy, obviously).

In all seriousness, Larry, I've never met a good, creative person in any field, who wasn't plagued by self doubt. The ones who are not, tend not to be very good.

[Guy Rowland]

Self doubt and confidence are both essential but disastrous in high enough doses.

[Guy Rowland]

Self doubt and confidence are both essential but disastrous in high enough doses.

[Guy Rowland]

Self doubt and confidence are both essential but disastrous in high enough doses.

[RobS]

deserved to be reiterated!

[RobS]

I always enjoy hearing that genius composers (Daryl, Rob, just to name two in this thread) have the same struggles with self doubt as I, a worker in the trenches, experience.

I also enjoy the tales of overcoming those voices, which one has to do to carry on.

not a genius either, Larry, but thanks for your respect...

[Tanuj Tiku]

It is hard to be objective completely when composing but with time you can hear the problems and some good bits.

I do suffer from serious self-doubt which has actually increased in recent years for some reason. Sometimes it is overwhelming but I have been told that one has to learn to accept it and know that it will always keep coming back and so you find a way to deal with it.

Most of what we do is a lonely process so it can be even worse at times but you have to deal with it one way or another.

I don't know what the opposite of this feels like except that I am usually suspicious of extreme confidence.

[Lawrence]

Your self doubt is unearned, Tanuj. .

Let’s face it , though, it’s a thing across the spectrum, affecting most creatives.

In an extreme case, I wonder if it’s what killed Johann Johannsen (pardon the spelling.)

[Ashermusic]

I think I can, but that may be self-delusion.