VSL Synchron Strings I

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Linos
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Linos » Dec 19, 2017 5:08 am

Paul posted a walkthrough video for the celli:

https://www.vsl.co.at/en/Synchron_Serie ... _I#!Videos

Mostly it sounds very good to me, with a few rough edges. But I like the legatos and crossfades in most cases.


FriFlo
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by FriFlo » Dec 19, 2017 5:21 am

There seems to be a first video walk though with the Celli:
https://www.vsl.co.at/en/Synchron_Serie ... _I#!Videos
As with the demos ... I am not super excited, but there are some things I like. That slow legato does not seem to work well for many things. On the one hand, I like that they did a less obvious legato which is what many criticise as "there is no legato!" :-) But on the other hand, it seems to produce holes in the line, which sounds unnatural. It seems very playable and I like the shorts, but I am afraid Paul is not the right guy to showcase these things. I liked the Pizzicato and shorts from the demos a lot. Yet, it still seems like a mixed bag to me ... so difficult to decide whether this will be phenomenal or just average, maybe even underwhelming in some aspects. What do you guys think?


FriFlo
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by FriFlo » Dec 19, 2017 5:24 am

Linos wrote:Paul posted a walkthrough video for the celli:

https://www.vsl.co.at/en/Synchron_Serie ... _I#!Videos

Mostly it sounds very good to me, with a few rough edges. But I like the legatos and crossfades in most cases.
You beat me! I was to slow. :-)


Pablo Crespo
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Pablo Crespo » Dec 23, 2017 7:24 am

So anybody did test this yet?

Can we have a discussion here without trolling and fanboish expressions? :)

I am torn between this and css (and that would drive the rest of the orchestra)
Pablo Crespo
Argentina


The Saxer
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by The Saxer » Dec 23, 2017 8:41 am

Didn't spend a lot of time with it but my first impressions:
I like the sound but I don't like the legatos. The transitions feel more like a gap instead of a movement from one note to the other. My hope was to finally realize 'slow motion trills' (two note legato ostinatos) without machine gun effect. I expected the 8 legato layers to avoid that but it doesn't work. The overall sound is very 3D without endless reverb samples but is has some VSL Appassionata livelessness in it. I think that happens to bigger sample sections (more than 10 violins). I find the same effect in Spitfire Symphonic Strings and 8Dios Magestica (last one from demo listening only). The Synchron slurred legatos are better but too much slur for everything and for my taste especially not useful for runs.
I don't know how this library will sound when it's completed. Maybe everything will fit together nicely. The depth is impressive (not only compared to other dry VSLs but also compared to CSS). I could imagine using the basic sound and add some closer strings on top. But that's speculation up to now...


Linos
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Linos » Dec 23, 2017 8:46 am

Quite strange how the thread on the other board is developing. I have the first violins and celli downloaded, but haven't had the time to test them yet. Maybe tonight. I am especially curious to hear how all the sections sound together. In the best case all sections blend together naturally to create an organic soundstage, but with each section still being able to be heard individually. I hear that with CSS and Berlin Strings. I hope it'll be the same with the Synchron Strings.


Pablo Crespo
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Pablo Crespo » Dec 23, 2017 10:49 am

I am not hearing nice connection between the notes on demos and tests. I want to like it though, the sound is nice
Pablo Crespo
Argentina

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Ashermusic
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Ashermusic » Dec 23, 2017 12:11 pm

Pablo, I love CSS (and HS) but this sounds good too. But very different sound, so I think it comes down to your taste.

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Muziksculp
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Muziksculp » Dec 23, 2017 12:17 pm

Pablo Crespo wrote:I am not hearing nice connection between the notes on demos and tests. I want to like it though, the sound is nice
Hopefully more demos will be posted. I'm not very fond of the currently posted demos, and wouldn't be surprised if better demos will be posted in the near future, that demonstrate a better legato connectivity, and better overall clarity of the strings, with less distractions from perc. and brass. in the demos.


Pablo Crespo
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Pablo Crespo » Dec 23, 2017 1:56 pm

Ashermusic wrote:Pablo, I love CSS (and HS) but this sounds good too. But very different sound, so I think it comes down to your taste.
Thanks Jay, I think my taste does like the sound of it, it is the technical side who is not convinced, the connection between the notes keeps bugging me off. Maybe the synchron player will fix it, but I am not hearing legato reinvented yet...and also, it is worth 400gb?

I want to like it very much, before the early bird ends, but if not I will go full cinematic studio
Pablo Crespo
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Guy Rowland
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Guy Rowland » Dec 23, 2017 2:10 pm

I'm not in this particular game, but I'm a curious outsider... what are VSL's claims for the legato? Their silent stage legato has never been bettered but that's precisely because its a silent stage.

Unless they have something genuinely new tech-wise with their player, its going to be the same old trade-offs. I've been really surprised at how good some ambient legato has gotten... Spitfire's Albion ONE is pretty remarkable, but it did take them many many years to get that good, and it still feels like a black art. I'm still of the view that the whole Synchon thing is a very expensive blind alley, and wish they'd poured all those resources into better spatial modelling. Rather cynically perhaps, my feeling is that they probably think that too, but knew they couldn't generate the same income from that.


Linos
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Linos » Dec 25, 2017 10:47 am

After having played with the library for a while here are some first observations: the Synchron Stage is a really nice hall. Beautiful and versatile sound, unobtrusive and just right. The provided VE Pro-Mixing-Template is a great starting point. I haven't dug too deep into the different mic positions yet, but they seem to be well chosen and easy to work with. Here is a little folly to demonstrate the room sound (Synchron Strings out of the box, no effects):

https://app.box.com/s/8me2xsvweguw6dpw5s2iv265fiysvji3

Some time ago I made a mockup of this piece with Dimension Strings. Here it is for comparison:

https://app.box.com/s/b7ab7tpwyw2cgr42sfiw0jzvos3uwwwe

I went with a more direct, closer sound there. But now in comparison I like the Synchron Stage version a lot better.

The legatos and shorts work differently than on Dimension Strings. It takes a bit of getting used to. I can't give a verdict on these just yet, but so far I like what I hear and think that both are fine. The omission of the portamento is a bit sad. Slurred legato is a nice addition, but it is not the same as portamento. Would be nice to have both.
Without the legatos on three of the sections it is difficult to make a nice comprehensive demo of everything playing together. Cheating your way through with sustains works so-so. I rather just wait for the legatos to be released.

Here is my attempt at the Jurassic Park melody. First violins only, out of the box, just one single pass:

https://app.box.com/s/o3zciglrexgwvhguzcd6oix3s0k843w0

Compared to how I have set up my Dimension Strings template the dynamic range of Synchron Strings is a bit narrower, making them seem to be less responsive to cc1 changes. Maybe I'll increase the DynR on Synchron Strings a bit (there is a slider for that in Vi Pro, so really simple to do). On the other hand it's nice to have everything recorded at their natural dynamics, so tampering with it is a bit of a tradeoff. Needs more experimenting before I decide.
Anyway, that's what jumped out at me after the first time with the library. Overall I am happy with the library so far.

Have a merry Christmas everyone.

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Tanuj Tiku
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Tanuj Tiku » Dec 29, 2017 9:36 am

Thanks for sharing the demos and I have also now listened to the new demos as well as other user posts on VI-C.

I am disappointed. I really thought it will turn out much better than it is. Unfortunately with new demos and Herb's legato demo, things sound worse.

Personally, I will not be buying this for now at least. The strings still sound anemic and have for some reason I cannot understand an overly pristine sound, devoid of emotion.

The shorts sound good enough in places but it is not enough to buy the library for me at this point because it will be a significant investment in integrating it into my workflow for marginal variety of shorts.

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PhJ
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by PhJ » Dec 29, 2017 10:01 am

It is really preplexing, there's not one demo (not talking about the musical aspect here) that is completely convincing.
(I can't help thinking "this would sound better with another library")


Pablo Crespo
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Pablo Crespo » Dec 29, 2017 10:06 am

Yes, I think I will go with the CSS+CSSS route, and then complete the cinematic orchestra...was tempted by spitfire and synchron for a moment but the original plan still holds

what do you think?
Pablo Crespo
Argentina


Lawrence
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Lawrence » Dec 29, 2017 11:02 am

And then someone (Piet, Rob?) writes a demo using Synchron that is so stunning we all rush out and buy them, because we're lemmings. :)
(YOU can call me Larry)

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Tanuj Tiku
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Tanuj Tiku » Dec 29, 2017 11:32 am

Lawrence wrote:And then someone (Piet, Rob?) writes a demo using Synchron that is so stunning we all rush out and buy them, because we're lemmings. :)
Larry, would have loved for that to happen. Unfortunately Piet has given a very damning verdict on Synchron Strings on VIC.

And I very much agree with him. There was some promise initially and I liked the clarity but it sounds lifeless on the whole and uninspiring outside of very high recording standards and what sounds like a great recording space.


Lawrence
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Lawrence » Dec 29, 2017 11:35 am

Sounds pretty dire, Tanuj. Unfortunate-I really had confidence that after all this time, Vienna would create the New New Thing that took things a step further.
(YOU can call me Larry)


Guy Rowland
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Guy Rowland » Dec 29, 2017 12:30 pm

Somehow (again as a bit of an outsider) VSL seem to have created the worst of all worlds - the sterility that has previously been attributed to the clinical sampling of the Silent Stage, with all the problems everyone has with an ambient stage.


Jack Weaver
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Jack Weaver » Dec 29, 2017 12:53 pm

But still, the sky is not falling.

True VSL has fallen short. But for me there is usage for Synchron Strings - so I bought it even after hearing all the fora noise. It should afford me even a bit more usage after Synchron Player is released. I should see Paul demo it at NAMM in late January. Do I expect it to replace my other, stalwart string libs? No. But yet there are a handful of good things in Synchron Strings.

As far VSL as a company is concerned. They have some egg on their face and have painted themselves into a corner. Can they, will they take proper steps to make a string library of such quality that all our jaws drop? It would take an admission on their own part to admit they are not perfect. Only after that painful realization can they be able to take steps to make a proper string lib.

VSL has the best business organization in the industry. All of us depend on their software daily. We need them to be solvent and thriving. Still, it is up to them to be a viable entity.

I wish them the best.

.

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Ashermusic
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by Ashermusic » Dec 29, 2017 12:58 pm

Well they are supposed to send it to me to review and as always, once I play it I will make my own assessment because even though there are lots of negative opinions from people I respect, I know that my personal taste can be quite different.

Not a believer in the idea that there is such a thing or ever will be as "proper steps to make a string library of such quality that all our jaws drop."


FriFlo
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Re: VSL Synchron Strings I

Post by FriFlo » Dec 29, 2017 1:24 pm

Lawrence wrote:Sounds pretty dire, Tanuj. Unfortunate-I really had confidence that after all this time, Vienna would create the New New Thing that took things a step further.
I think most of us have, but it seems there are only a few things to really like about this in its current state. But I am sure they will revise their strategy, as most people (except for those that want it to be good sooo much, that they lost their ears) are complaining. They just have to, otherwise they will be a thing of the past, soon ...

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